tbaangel-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 52 Today's Topics: Re: Yesterday's Episode Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again (the song) Just joined the ML Re: Ages of Angels Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again Loved the episode this week! Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again indoctrination to the AiA club Match made in Heaven re: Re: re: Ages of angels Welcome Andrea! Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again Fwd: Stuff re: Re: re: Ages of angels re: re: Re: re: Ages of angels TBAA...ages of angels re: TBAA...ages of angels My (belated) intro When did Martha Williamson become EP? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:57:46 -0400 (EDT) From: AmilynH @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Re: Yesterday's Episode In a message dated 97-04-28 18:57:11 EDT, Colleen wrote: >I love how TBAA uses >people of all races, colors, religions, etc. in its episodes. This is rather interesting. I was planning to post a note to the list today complaining about the way the show has dealt with people of color this season. I tend to see current TBAA, with the exception of Della's presence (and Paul Winfield's recurring character Sam), as being an *incredibly* segregated program. I also tend to feel that it has been lately, in its casting choices for ethnicity of characters, often quite racist. While I actually quite liked last night's episode and thought that in a great many ways it was one of the better ones they've had in a while, I was actually quite annoyed with the casting of the juvie kids. There was not a single white kid in the group that was saw for the whole episode. There was one guy who *looked* fairly white, but he had a distinctly Hispanic name. I have heard the phrase "Touched by an Anglo" used to refer to the show, and this is the program that inspired me come up with the line, "Jim Crow is alive and well and living in Hollywood." I do know that there are a great many shows that are doing no better or do worse, but this is one of the ones I've been watching regularly, and I have become increasingly troubled by and sensitive to the show's recent propensity for having a Black Episode and a White Episode, and rarely the twain shall meet. First season did some very good work. "Fallen Angel" was beautifully color-blind. The pregnant girl in "Cassie's Choice" was white, which supports a very real, very large statistic, rather than the typical Hollywood stereotype. In "There But for the Grace of God" homelessness was an equal opportunity demon. "The Hero" was a nicely done episode that seemed relatively color-blind to me; they seemed to have written the parts and then cast them with whomever seemed best for the job (rather than writing "black characters" and casting accordingly). "Fear Not" seemed to also do a good job with color-blind casting. First season's one real bomb on this issue, in my opinion, was "Manny", which I found downright offensive; the only non-white characters were the kid (who was adorable--I really liked his character and thought the actor did very good work) and the unseen gardner (who was spoken well of, but heavily judged by many characters based on his ethnicity and occupation). Second season also had excellent work in regards to ethnicity, in my opinion, with episodes like "Jacob's Ladder" (again, color-blind casting, and attention to the fact that a great many of the soldiers in Vietnam were black), "The Driver" (color-blind casting, avoidance of stereotyping, even in the case of the Hispanic family, I felt--I did *very* much like the mother; she was excellently written and played in my opinion). Although I didn't really care for "Reunion" as an episode, it did seem fairly well balanced against eps like "Till We Meet Again", since they were family episodes, and therefore, logically cast in the same ethnicity. "Rock 'n' Roll Dad" was fairly color-blind. "Dear God" had the advantage of showing that there are white people living in abject poverty rather than doing the frequently typica Hollywood portrayal of poor=black. Still, this left 11 episodes that were basically All-White Episodes, which is half of the season. I have found this season intensely frustrating on this issue. "Sins of the Father", "South Central Mall/Amazing Grace" and "Volunteers" (the main "Black" episodes) have shown crime-ridden black communities. I am not trying to say that this is not a situation that exists. However, for three of the four "Black Episodes" to portray this rather skews the picture they are presenting. The other "Black" episode, "Smokescreen" was so fraught with stereotypes and heavy handed moralizing that it also left a bad taste. And leaves about 17 episodes that were basically "White" episodes. "Last Call" seemed a *bit* balanced at first, and then, again, had the criminal be a black guy. With this record, I do consider it to their credit that the criminals in "Random Acts" were white kids, but it doesn't really balance out the rest of the season for me. I do see the continuing tendency for America to be segregated ethnically in much the same way that the US tends to be very polarized in general. However, I expect to play us a shade above where we are. I am glad that angelhood is equal opportunity and that, amongst the angels, ethnicity is not even an issue or really something that is noticed. However, if the people (the *real* people) in our fantasies and fiction cannot interact as though ethnicity were a non-issue, how can the country begin to conceive of itself behaving that way in reality to a greater extent than we manage it now? Bright Blessings, Amilyn ---- May the spirits stand between you and harm in all the empty places where you walk. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 23:05:17 -0400 (EDT) From: SunbirdSE @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again The name of the group that did "Hold Your Head Up" was Argent (see, I really am older than dirt!) Jan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 20:27:04 +0000 From: "Ray Simard" To: TBAAngel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again (the song) > From: Diana Seals-Hopkins > To: "'tbaangel @ . .execpc.com'" > Subject: thoughts on this weeks ep again > Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:02:30 -0400 >Hey does anyone out there remember the song that was played in the >background? I can (boy am I "dating" myself here or what), just can't >place the group who did it, and it's driving me nuts, as I think I may >still have a copy of that song around somewhere. I think the title >was Hold You Head Up. Can anyone help me remember? Diana angelgirl Yes; it's "Hold Your Head Up" by Rod Argent. I don't think it was released under another artist or group name, though I could be wrong about that. Great choice for that part of the show! There's more on it at: http://www.livjm.ac.uk/fish/html/discogs/details/headup.htm There's a link there to another page with the lyrics. -- Ray Simard rsimard @ . .addy.com "Who you are is more essential than that. It comes from God. And what you make of yourself, that is what you give back to God." Monica (from The Quotable Angel) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 23:44:56 -0400 (EDT) From: JustReno @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Just joined the ML Hello everyone, Thanks, Jennie, for getting me going on this mailing list. It will be great meeting even more folks that enjoy Touched By An Angel, and who, like myself, are touched each week by our beloved trio. I look forward to meeting all of you here. I'm Diane Taylor, I live in Central New Jersey. As well as being a fan of TBAA I also believe in angels and know of two of my own. I don't have a paticular favorite angel, so look at them as: Tess: a long time friend of the family, Monica: someone I wish my brother had married and Andrew: my adopted brother. Who else is here that I already know? later, di ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 21:33:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Tina Goin To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Re: Ages of Angels I think it would be great if they used a child angel once in a while. I'm not quite sure how they'd incorporate it into the trio, maybe "assign" him or her to one of the others? (Hey J/AiA - picture this: Andrew working side by side with a cute little tyke - That would just be too adorable! :p ) It's possible that they may use a "cherub" someday because in the first Christmas ep, "Fear Not", Monica asked Serena if her teddy bear, Mr. Beans, was a cherub. Serena then asked Monica what a cherub was, and she replied "a baby angel". So, they have acknowledged the existance of "little angels" in the past. Hopefully we'll get to see one sometime soon! BTW, I loved Sunday's ep! Once again, TBAA managed to take a real-to-life topic and present it in such a way that melts your heart and makes you think. I don't know exactly why, but Andrew just seemed to look even sweeter than usual this week(if that's really possible!):) Take care and God bless, === Tina _____________________________________________________________________ Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.addy.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 21:36:06 -0700 From: "Frank and Lynn Foley" To: "Diana Seals-Hopkins" , "'tbaangel @ . .execpc.com'" Subject: Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again "Hold Your Head Up" by Argent (British rock quartet. Consisted of ex-Zombies (She's Not There, Time Of The Season) member Rod Argent(vocals, keyboards), Jim Rodford (bass; Argent's cousin), Robert Henrit (drums) and Russ Ballard (guitar). The song was on the Billboard Hot 100 chart starting on 6/17/72 and stayed on the chart 15 weeks peaking at position 5. It was on Epic records (in the US - Epic 10852) and was the only charting song by the group. Now, aren't you sorry you asked? (You don't KNOW what it is to be dated, Ma'am). Respectfully, Frank Foley Note: some of the above info was from the book "Joel Whitburn's Top Pop Singles 1955-1990" (1991 Record Research, Memomeonee Falls, Wisconsin) ---------- From: Diana Seals-Hopkins To: 'tbaangel @ . .execpc.com' Subject: thoughts on this weeks ep again Date: Monday, April 28, 1997 7:02 PM ... snip ... Hey does anyone out there remember the song that was played in the background? I can (boy am I "dating" myself here or what), just can't place the group who did it, and it's driving me nuts, as I think I may still have a copy of that song around somewhere. I think the title was Hold You Head Up. Can anyone help me remember? Well I gotta go. TTFN. Diana angelgirl ---------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 01:13:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Finabair @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Loved the episode this week! I thought those kids were *absolutely* darling! And Kelly has *such* a lovely smile! Diana said: >Andrew came into the room while Jason was blowing bubbles at Kelly (I think I >have the names right), and started trying to catch the bubbles....what a big kid!!! I thought it looked more like he was teasing the kid in the wheelchair...but either way, I agree. :-) That was precious too! The only thing that didn't work for me in this episode was the confrontation between the moms...that kinda fell flat for me. Loved the touch with Jason putting the photo of the Ferrari on the front of Kelly's chair when she's working, loved that it's the presence of the kids that stopped Jason from going after that guy who was harrassing him...loved a lot of things. Take care, Jennie finabair @ . .addy.com *** Beware the gree fungus...your eyeballs will thank you for it! *** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:38:21 -0700 (PDT) From: john flanders To: Diana Seals-Hopkins cc: "'tbaangel @ . .execpc.com'" Subject: Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again > > Hey does anyone out there remember the song that was played in the background? I can (boy am I "dating" myself here or what), just can't place the group who did it, and it's driving me nuts, as I think I may still have a copy of that song around somewhere. I think the title was Hold You Head Up. Can anyone help me remember? > > Well I gotta go. TTFN. > > Diana > angelgirl > > It was called `hold your head up' by a band called `Argent' If I remember correctly, the lead singer is now singing for `Bad Company' Now I've _really_ dated myself!! john ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 02:19:04 -0400 (EDT) From: AMarsh8597 @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: indoctrination to the AiA club O:) Gosh I feel honored and blessed to be considered as a fellow sister of the "Androolers". O:) Gosh and even after I made the accidental not-so-nice comment about all the "Andrew drivel" on the list. Thank you for your forgiveness. :) I accept. Thank you. :) I just merely thought the photographer at school reminded me of Andrew/John Dye in that he had long dusty blond hair pulled back in a ponytail, and deep eyes that showed compassion and a good eye for art. Don't worry girls there are lots of guys out there with the compassion and sincerity that John Dye portrays in his character(and apparently in his life). Have faith. God Bless, "Miss Wings"/ Andrea :) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:23:34 -0700 From: marlis ostermann To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Match made in Heaven Darn, I hate living in the boonies :-( I've got to move out to civilization and *cable* T.V. I could not get Match made in Heaven here, but what was it about? I hope it airs again sometime, when I can pick it up. Someone asked when it was made. My TV listings listed it as a 1997 drama, but I don't know if that was when it was filmed - it may have stayed in storage for a year or two before release. My bets are that it was made after TBAA started, so the red convertable was probably an intentional inside joke. Nice touch! Later, Marlis ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 97 9:08:36 EDT From: "Michael Miller" To: Subject: re: Re: re: Ages of angels charset=US-ASCII Hi! In response to Andrea's message: Cherub's are not baby angels. I'm not sure how that connotation came about. The full name of Cherub's are Cherubim. Cherubim are HUGE fierce-looking angels. When God blocked the entrance to Eden He placed 2 cherub's in front of the entrance, and each had a flaming sword. If you read in Scripture, Ezekial I believe, when it refers to Lucifer (Satan) as the anointed Cherub. Lucifer meant Angel of Light. Of course, after the fall, Lucifer became Satan. Seraphim are very similar to Cherubim. I believe that the Seraphim are around the throne of God. As far as I know there are only 3 types of angels, Archangels, Seraphim, and Cherubim. Mike ************************************************************* Only the individual sender is responsible for the content of this message, and the message does not necessarily reflect the position or policy of the National Education Association or NEA Member Benefits. ************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 09:46:04 -0500 (CDT) From: Darla Bradley To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Welcome Andrea! Andrea wrote: >Don't worry girls >there are lots of guys out there with the compassion and sincerity that John >Dye portrays in his character(and apparently in his life). Have faith. You're *so* right, Andrea! John (and his character, Andrew) possesses the qualities we'd *all* like a "significant other" to have. Andrew is the "mirror" through which we look inside ourselves. Each week, he teaches us, by his example, that the important things in life come from deep within us. They are our feelings and emotions, and their relationship to our interactions with each other. A life without love, sadness, joy, fear, peace, anger, laughter, grief, etc., is *not* a full, balanced life. Each of these emotions has its proper place and time, and each serves to help us appreciate life to its fullest. (Kinda weird, huh. . .that the Angel of Death could teach you to appreciate just how precious life is?) What a novel idea! ;) No wonder those folks over at TBAA have such a huge "hit" on their hands! :) Yes, there are considerate, sincere, sensitive, gentle, compassionate men *still* out there in this world. (Some of them belong to this list. . .love you, guys!) We just have to keep looking until we find them, have patience, and ask God's help in our search. They are definitely worth waiting for!!! Welcome to J/AiA, Andrea! :) Love to you all. . .and miles of smiles! Darla ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 11:54:33 -0400 (EDT) From: IDyeForYou @ . .addy.com To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Re: thoughts on this weeks ep again In a message dated 97-04-28 23:01:16 EDT, you write: << know Roma, Della and John were "acting", they all seemed to truely care about being with those kids, and their expressions were priceless.... While it's true they were "acting"...not by much. John is the only one I know for certain...but he fell head over heels in love with Kelly...he says she is a true angel. She turned him into a big teddybear, I suspect. Hey does anyone out there remember the song that was played in the background? I can (boy am I "dating" myself here or what), just can't place the group who did it, and it's driving me nuts, as I think I may still have a copy of that song around somewhere. I think the title was Hold You Head Up. Can anyone help me remember? >> It was Hold Your Head Up by Argent....Now I've dated myself.... Susan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 13:43:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Finabair @ . .addy.com To: TBAAngel @ . .execpc.com Subject: Fwd: Stuff This bounced. :-) Jennie --------------------- Forwarded message: From: VMISIXFIVE @ . .addy.NET To: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Date: 97-04-29 04:06:52 EDT Hello, Patricia, once again. Well, it seems as if our e-mail address has changed, again. I'm still getting things sent to VMISIXFIVE @ . .addy.net, but try VMISIXFIVE @ . .addy.net, if you need to contact me. Jennie, contact me if this is a problem. Thanks. OOPS! I misspelled "Xena" the other day in reference to the "Celeste" debate. Sorry about that :( ! Susan, I noticed on Sat. that you had just spoken to John's mom, and that he was supposed to be in "USA Today", Fri., April 25, 1997. Well, I went out and bought one, and the only article that I saw was, "Colin Powell, Cosby earn 'Angel' Wings". Was that it? Or did I miss the article? It was in the "Life" section. Thanks :) ! Also, are you having any luck with the "New York Times", Liz Smith column from early April? I can't find anything on-line, so far. I loved "A Match Made In Heaven"! I found it to be rather touching, funny, and somewhat true to life. I thought Della's performance was wonderful as the nanny/housekeeper/friend. It was great to see her in something different, and she had some great dry-witted lines : "Well, don't look at me like I shot the dog!" LOL! Finally, yes, I agree with everyone who said the red convertible was a nice touch. Well, what more can I add, concerning Sunday's episode? I loved it; it was touching (the Jason/Kelly storyline); John had his hair down ; my mother and I were crying by the end when the mothers were "squaring off", when Jason accepted his mother's love, and esp. when Jason and Kelly were reunited ! I agree with Diana when she said she liked the three angels working together. I thought it balanced the story out. Hmmm...reminded me of the "Six Hands" ep. I can't wait to see Thursday's repeat (missed it for some reason the first time around), and next Sunday's looks interesting. To everyone who was so helpful in my finding "Campus Man", I went to Blockbuster and asked them about it. I will order a copy as soon as I have the money. Thanks, everyone :) !!!!!! I did, however, get a chance to rent "Best Of The Best", and I loved it! I laughed at the beginning (esp. the bar fight scene), but was crying by the end. John plays a very adorable, low-key character, Virgil, but he shines in the role. The other actors are just as good, and the movie (gasp) has a plot! I would recommend renting it. ( I almost didn't recognize John - much younger, glasses, short hair, beard,, skinnier, but still good looking, never the less .) Finally, my favorite lines : (In Bar) Woman: "I thought you were serious." Virgil: "No, I'm Virgil." He asks her to dance; they do. Well, that's it. Take Care and God Bless, Patricia ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 10:58:14 -0700 (MST) From: Dorothy E Tinkler To: Michael Miller cc: tbaangel @ . .execpc.com Subject: re: Re: re: Ages of angels Hi Mike: The connotation about cherubs being baby angels came about because Monica said they were. I guess in the TBAA world that's how things are. I believe there are traditionally nine choirs of angels, but again in TBAA land we have only heard of three (angels, archangels, and cherubim). I don't know where the Angel of Angels fits in, or for that matter special service (like Sam). Dorothy On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Michael Miller wrote: > Hi! In response to Andrea's message: Cherub's are not baby angels. I'm not > sure how that connotation came about. The full name of Cherub's are > Cherubim. Cherubim are HUGE fierce-looking angels. When God blocked the > entrance to Eden He placed 2 cherub's in front of the entrance, and each had > a flaming sword. If you read in Scripture, Ezekial I believe, when it refers > to Lucifer (Satan) as the anointed Cherub. Lucifer meant Angel of Light. Of > course, after the fall, Lucifer became Satan. Seraphim are very similar to > Cherubim. I believe that the Seraphim are around the throne of God. As far > as I know there are only 3 types of angels, Archangels, Seraphim, and > Cherubim. > > Mike > > > > ************************************************************* > Only the individual sender is responsible for the content > of this message, and the message does not necessarily reflect > the position or policy of the National Education Association > or NEA Member Benefits. > ************************************************************* > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 97 14:12:01 EDT From: "Michael Miller" To: Cc: Subject: re: re: Re: re: Ages of angels I know that Monica mentioned cherubs as baby angels, but in society in general people refer to cherubs as baby angels. I've never heard of nine choirs of angels. I only know what the Bible refers to, which is Archangels, Seraphim, and Cherubim. The only one who I could think of who would be referred to as the Angel of Angels would be Jesus possibly. In Scripture He is referred to sometimes as the Captain of the Heavenly Hosts. Mike ************************************************************* Only the individual sender is responsible for the content of this message, and the message does not necessarily reflect the position or policy of the National Education Association or NEA Member Benefits. ************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 11:26:30 -0700 From: Richard Treadwell To: TBAAngel @ . .execpc.com Subject: TBAA...ages of angels Greetings.... "Just curious, since there really is no such thing as a child angel." Why not?...just curious...:) Hmmm...do angels age? Or does God allow them to assume human bodies of differing ages to be able to relate to humans of differing ages and to experience what it is like to "humanly" age. It's obvious that Tess is older than Monica...except in that one episode. Why then not assuming a child's body to be "for" children? In His Love, Dick, P.S. With God all things are possible... ******************************************************************** Richard Treadwell treadwel @ . .addy.com Living God, for whom no door is closed, no heart is locked, draw us beyond our doubts, till we see your Christ and touch his wounds where they bleed in others. New Zealand Prayer Book, p. 599 ******************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 97 14:49:38 EDT From: "Michael Miller" To: Subject: re: TBAA...ages of angels charset=US-ASCII >"Just curious, since there really is no such thing >as a child angel." > Why not?...just curious...:) It's not biblical. ************************************************************* Only the individual sender is responsible for the content of this message, and the message does not necessarily reflect the position or policy of the National Education Association or NEA Member Benefits. ************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 12:31:29 +0000 From: "Ray Simard" To: TBAAngel @ . .execpc.com Subject: My (belated) intro I've been on this list for about a week now and I am very pleasantly impressed by the enthusiasm here for this wonderful show! A very special friend got me watching TBAA one night (the "Groundrush" episode), and I became instantly enthralled, even though we only caught about the last half. I don't watch much television and most of what I do is news, public affairs and that sort of thing. So I was completely unaware of TBAA; when I saw that episode I naively thought the show was in its first season. I hope that, sometime and somehow, I'll get to see some of the episodes from the last two years. I spent a little time digging back through the archives of the major newspaper in this area, the San Diego Union-Tribune, and was rather amused by the criticisms and predictions of an early demise for TBAA published in its infancy. Promised Land is getting some of the same treatment now; I hope TBAA's history repeats for it. But even now, some of the comments I see refer to it as "feel-good" programming, a vapid, "sanitized" version of things. How short-sighted! In the short time I've been watching, I"ve seen TBAA deal with a man's torment over having killled his sister's rapist, a woman agonizing decision between a career she's always wanted and saving a man's life, a man's aspirations colliding with two cultural traditions, the critical need for all of us to contribute our own time and resources for the betterment of our world...and that's only a few. These look like serious, real-world problems to me. Like Roma said on Rosie O'Donnell, the angel trio doesn't just show up and wave a magic wand to make everything better. It's the show's characters who change direction and make the difference when they learn that they are never alone and unloved, and then find the courage, with God's help, to face not only the problems around them, but also the problems within themselves. I don't think that's just feel-good-ism at all. So, I'm very glad to have discovered TBAA and very happy to be here with all of you. -- Ray Simard rsimard @ . .addy.com "Who you are is more essential than that. It comes from God. And what you make of yourself, that is what you give back to God." Monica (from The Quotable Angel) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 12:40:34 +0000 From: "Ray Simard" To: TBAAngel @ . .execpc.com Subject: When did Martha Williamson become EP? Does anyone know about when it was that Martha Williamson take over the reins as exec producer? As I said in my intro, I've been looking over comments made when the show was new and I'd like to compare what was said before and after that time. -- Ray Simard rsimard @ . .addy.com "Who you are is more essential than that. It comes from God. And what you make of yourself, that is what you give back to God." Monica (from The Quotable Angel) -------------------------------- End of tbaangel-d Digest V97 Issue #52 **************************************